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KZN185 - SUSPENSION Just Cruzin
Shockies, Springs (leaf, coils), Dampers, Struts, Steering components, Bushes, Torsion Bars, Body Lifts, Suspension Lifts;

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Here to Help

Posts: 306
4/24/03 8:21 am
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Suspension Upgrade Just Cruzin
bambi
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KZN185 Suspension
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Hi everyone,

over the last few weeks I've been having a look into replacing the current factory suspension setup in my '98 surf. From what I have encountered so far, there is quite a lot of differing opinions as to what the best idea is.

The rear is similar to the rest of the surf's, with coil springs, shocks and a panhard rod. The front is a strut setup with a coil and shock. I think from what I have found so far, that the best option is King springs all round. The $64 question is what shocks are the best?

So far I have been told Bilstein, Koni, Rancho, OME (but they are an arrogant lot!), Series 2000 and Fireflex (had never heard of them!). I am slowly going around the twist trying to workout what is best. I have told them all the same thing, I don't mind a firmer setup on tar, but would rather have better off-road performance for when I need it.

I think probably the best of the above lot would be either the Koni or Bilstein.......any suggestions?

couchy
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(9/12/02 9:56 pm )
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suspention mods
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My Surf is the same as yours. I put king medium springs on mine front and rear. Lifted the car 30mm on front and about 50 mm on rear. I put rancho shocks on all round. They only have the 5000 non adjustable for the front. On the back I put the adjustable 9000.
I have them set on the 4th. stiffest setting out of 5.
I can't tell any difference between these and the old ones.
cheers
Gary

manyanna51
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Re: suspention mods
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I own a surf now, but last vehicle was a Discvery fitted with Konis, and in my opinion was too harsh. They controlled the bounce well but the ride was hard. They lasted a long time, and spent a lot of miles on gravel, but were hard riding. Next time I will use either Bilsteins or Rancho's, Tom.

Beddo
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(9/28/02 8:35 pm )
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KZN185 suspension replacement
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Do Cape York and replace your springs - mine have had it the front still are working still just, but the rear from Weipa back down were sitting on the bump stops - the addition of tennis balls in the springs assisted. Have heard from Fulcrum suspension in Cairns that Bilstein were good (expensive though), also heard in Gosford King springs and the Ranchos are a good option. Was warned not to go too heavy with the springs - have been told to go progressive springs with 2inch lift. The heavy duty spring will be no good in corrugations - the standard springs worked well until they sagged. Heard mention before I left that the rear coils, had a question mark over them re length differing from that of the Prados - any updates ? Cheers Beddo

bambi
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Re: KZN185 suspension replacement
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Thanks Beddo,

yeah have decided to go for the progressive 2" King springs and Bilstein shocks. From what I can work out they seem to be the best combination for what I'm looking at. The Rancho's seem to be ok, but I have heard many stories about their inablility to control the spring when it compresses (both from here & the U.S).

The comments of that place in Cairns are the icing on the cake! Thanks for the comments.

Cheers,

Troy.
===================================================================
Beddo
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(9/30/02 8:35 pm )
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KZN185 springs
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OK, from discussion King springs are the go heavy duty or medium, I guess medium is the better option and also being progressive ? What lift are these giving ? I take note of the Koni's being too harsh, what about Bilstein ? OME was told will give softer ride - though reliability by a certain supplier was questioned ! "Bambi" have you had your susp replaced yet & what were the results. What quotes has everyone got ? Cheers Beddo

bambi
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(9/30/02 8:44 pm )
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Re: KZN185 springs
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G'day Beddo,
no, haven't had it replaced as yet, just haven't had the time to be able to have the car off the road. The quotes that I have for King springs and Bilstein are around the $1400 - $1500 mark. The quote that ARB gave me for their setup was around the $1800 mark, although they were too much on the arrogant side for my money. TJM south side have been very friendly and a pleasure to deal with so far, and most likely they will get the job, when time permits.

Cheers,Troy.


Beddo
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(7/11/02 9:24:58 pm )
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After market suspension ?
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Who has replaced the "hard-soft" standard suspension & what did you replace it with ? What is the handling comparison with the standard suspension both on & off road ?
Has anyone replaced them on the KZN185 or a Prado ?
Hey Ptk have you kept yours standard ?


Ptk Melb
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(7/11/02 11:23:15 pm )
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To Beddo RE:Suspension
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Hi Beddo, Yeah i will keep it until it breaks, then upgrade.
Was told original shock set up is worth about $2500.00.

Cheers Peter K


jrebbeckSA
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(7/16/02 1:40:45 pm )
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After Market Suspension
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Hi Beddo, I have replaced my suspension both up front and in the rear. In the rear I have 19mm heavy duty custom made coils and Rancho RS9000's and Pedders Trak Riders in the front. I would say it's about a 200% inprovement for handling. The 19mm coils prevent body roll and sag in the rear when loaded. It's raised the rear about 2In above the wheels and about 3.5In at the rear. The original Surf suspension on the 2.4ltr just wasn't cut out for our conditions.
Cheers


luke
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(7/20/02 7:19:23 pm )
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suspension
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I'm cujrrently sourcing suspension for my KZN185. I tried Prado, but it didn't really work, so I've had some rear springs custom made along with modified rear shocks. The front will be standard raised Prado at this point. I'll keep you posted on how it went.




luke
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(7/21/02 9:06:26 pm )
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suspension
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The "raised" Prado rear springs were actually shorter than the standard coils, just firmer so they don't sag as much when you lower the Surf back onto the springs.
It did ride quite well with them in place, a bit firmer, but not too harsh. The problem was two-fold.
One was that I only gained 34mm lift, the other was more serious. With the rear diff. at full droop, it was hanging on the sway bar, not the shocks. They still had about 2" of travel. even worse was that you could literally reach up and remove the springs with your bare hands! Can you imagine driving over train lines or getting serious off road and a coil falls out?
The bloke I bought them off was good enough to give me a refund and was more than fair about the whole thing. The business is Auto Extras at Herston. As I promised, I'll keep you informed as to the progress of my new kit which should be ready this week. It consists of Prado raised coils and Bilstein shocks at the front with the custom made springs and modified shocks at the rear.


couchy
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(8/22/02 3:01:53 pm )
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suspension upgrade
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I am in the process of upgrading my 3lt turbo diesel intercooled.
I am putting medium strenth King coils uner the front and back. Rancho 5000 on the front and Rancho 9000 adjustables on the rear. To be able to take all the excess weight, I am putting pumpup airbags in the rear springs with a compressor under the bonnet to do my tyres as well. I will be able to adjust the height from the drivers seat. I hate my light not being adjusted right so hopefully this can over come that.
Cheers
Gary



Beddo: Now ready to lift 3"- 4"
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Hi Beddo, Just came back from a weekend away with the boys, Camping and some off road stuff. Drove down an 10 foot rock face, very slowly walked it down but the rear wheels slid just at the last bit and the car came down heavily on the right side hayman reece flange with a big thump.(no Damage) Drove up it ok ??. Made me realise that the car needs to be lifted to confidently drive obstacles without wondering will it ? or won't it????. I want to go at least 4 inches if possible with long travel shocks & springs. Also had fun driving the rocky & dirt roads at 90 ks/hr in 4High. car was very zippy and stable. felt like a sports car.....
Will keep you posted as to what i do to lift the car.
PS: Couchy posted he has an intercooled 3Ltr.
do you know what year it is ,or is it an aftermaket intercooler????

Cheers Peter K


bambi
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Re: After market suspension ?
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Hey Guys,

I'm in a similar position. I have a 3l turbo intercooled diesel and I'm looking to raise the height a few inches. From what I've been looking at King springs and it seems Rancho shocks are the go. Has anybody here got the 9000's all around with the in cab ride adjustment? What does it go like?

Also has anybody in here done a body lift to a KZN 185? If so, I'd be very interested in how it went, who did it and $$$.

Cheers,

Troy.


gav
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(9/1/02 11:32:10 pm )
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After Market Suspension
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Guys check this link out
www.4x4wire.com/toyota/4R...uspension/

USA Forerunner is same as the Surf, this site has some great info on 3rd generation Forerunner Lifts

Looks like ARB may have a decent OME kit.

Gav

couchy
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(9/11/02 12:34:43 pm )
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suspension upgrade
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I just installed all the stuff I mentioned in my last post. The King springs and Rancho shocks. Also the pumpup air bags in the rear. On the 97 surf they have coils on the front and you can't install the Rancho 9000 adjustable shocks. Only the 5000. On the rear are the ajustable ones. I started of on the lowest setting first but the ride was much to soft. I increased the setting to eventually stay at the fourth highest setting. They only have five. This gave about the same ride as I had with the old shocks. The King springs increased the height by about 30-40 mm at the front and about 50-60 mm at the rear. But when I install the larger fuel tank at the rear it will lift the front and drop the rear so as to level the car. The pump up air bags really lift the rear up if you pump them up. It will be great for when we are loaded up to head off. The compressor works well especially with the large airtank for reserve. Pump up tyres in no time flat. Had to install it under the bullbar though.
The pump is live all the time so I installed a battery saver device that only allows the compressor to start up when the voltage goes over 12.9 volts so it only really starts up when the motor is running or the batteries are fully charged. Works really well.
Cheers
Gary


Ptk Melb
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(9/11/02 11:32:30 pm )
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Re : our Cars & Hello
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Hi Couchy, there don't seem to be many people with late intercooled models around. I have a Dec 96 SSRG intercooled,Beddo has a 97 Intercooled. What is your State & model. Looks like it is three of us so far. I am very pleased with the car as it is in mint condition and drives very well. But would like to lift it for better off road use.
Only thing it is a shame to remove perfectly good shocks and suspension that are worth a lot of money.Will store old bits, and put them on when new suspension packs up. Happy Surfin Couchy

See Yah !
Peter K


bambi
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Re: After market suspension ?
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Hi Peter,

well I'll make it 4 late models. I drive a '98 white SSR-X 3 litre intercooled turbo (a white one). It's a lovley car to drive, and mave done many happy km's since I bought it, about 19 months ago. At the moment I'm having a look around at raising the suspension about 2" for better off road handling. A few of the other mods that I'm looking at are a snorkel, 2" body lift, long range tank and a roof rack. Might even lash out and put an airlocker in as well!

When I get the chance I'll post a couple of pics on the board for you.

Cheers,

Troy.


couchy
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(9/12/02 9:25:30 pm )
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suspension upgrade
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My Surf is a 97 what they call a 'wide body' Surf. Had it for about 3 years. Just replaced the timing belt. 100000 kms.
I am going down to Melb on Monday to have an extra tank installed in the space behind the rear diff. They will make it to suit. Will probably hold about 120 lts. Plus they are making a frame beside it to take 2 extra batteries. Cost $1250.00
Thought about the diff lockers but can't justify them unless you are going to do a lot of rock hopping which I won't be.
Mine has a limited slip diff on the back and it works well.
As for the suspention mods, I wanted to lift the car up a bit and also to be able to carry a lot heavier load so the larger springs. The shocks don't seem to be much better than the originals but I wanted some spares so I put the new ones on the car.
Also to get that extra height I had to get new tyres anyway so I put larger A/T tyres on. 265.75.
The standard ones where 265.70. That extra gave me about 1 to 1.5 inches extra. The tyres where actually cheaper than the standard size but they just rub on the underside of the guard when I turn and hit a large bump at the same time. It's acceptable though.
By the I come from Vic. Warrnambool.

cheers
Gary

couchy
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suspension upgrade
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I have just got home from Melb and the extra batteries won't fit under with the new fuel tank. I am going to get a couple of Optima's and fit them inside. The place that is fitting the fuel tank is Longrangeautomotive.The guy that owns the place did the dealing with me and I couldn't have been happier with the service. I had the choice of a smaller tank, (about 60 lts.) with batteries or 100 plus lts. without batteries. The extra fuel was more important to me.
Cheers
Gary

Edited by: Just Cruzin at: 6/26/03 5:45 am

Here to Help

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5/25/03 9:58 pm
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Suspension Lift Just Cruzin
Mick
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(9/15/02 12:10 pm )
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Body Lift Kits
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Has any one put a body lift on 3lt yet. Starting to look around so any help or hints would be good.

bambi
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Re: Body Lift Kits
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Mick,

I have been having a look at this in order to gain a little more ground clearance. Over all looking at 2" suspension lift and 2" body lift.

There are a few people around that can do it:
Macquarie 4x4
Nick Mannell (he really seems to know what he's talking about)
Snake Racing
to name just a few.

However, the other day I found a site calle Big Balls Off Road, who say on their bit about body lifts, "that these are not for vehicles with air bags". This seems a little funny as there are many of these over in the USA that have gone through the body lift exercise. I have asked this question via email to Nick Mannell (he's at Hornsby) and just waiting for a repaly from him. If I decide to go ahead with it, I'm thinking that he the man.

Cheers, Troy.


Surfin Alec
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Re: Body Lift Kits
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What info do you require?
I have done a 3" on my 3 litre.
Email me if you like alec1@myplace.net.au
I don`t advise going to Nick Mannell though....charges harded than a wounded bull & have heard some suss sounding stories.
Macquarie 4x4 did mine. If you have the tools & time, I would do it yourself. I can give you a list of what needs doing if you want.
Cheers, Alec H


Mick
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(10/8/02 8:42 pm )
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Price For Body Lift
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Ask ARB in Maroochydore for a quote on a lift kit. 2inches was $875, they do the lift and any extensions to cables, levers etc. Is this a reasonable quote. I have also looked up Marks Adapters, they do a kit for Forerunners, has any one checked this kit or used it.

Surfin Alec
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Re: Price For Body Lift
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Mick,

Sounds like a fairly resonable price if they do every thing. Make sure they include mods to the gear sticks ( I cut the floor rather than the stick), & check about the front bar which is attached to the chassis. The rear bar & steps go with the body. Nothing looks worse than a body lifted 4x4 and the front bumper/bull bar has been left behind. Also if you have your spare under the rear the winding mech also has to be lifted. ( I found out at the wrong time).
Ask if they will arrange for an engineer cert. Insurance may not like you if its not insured. Some insurance comps will not insure a moded 4x4. Check.

Other than that, Surf`s look awesome with a body lift.

Enjoy, Alec H

===================================================================
Simonsurf
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(1/12/03 10:21:07 am )
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KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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Macquarie 4x4 has a 4" lift kit available for the Prado so it should fit the Surf. It includes all extended brake lines and castor bushes etc... If there is anyone in Sydney who is willing to check it out and get back to the rest of us about what they thought that would be great. I would do it but I live too far away and don't have the time. They are located at Shop 2/20 Curtis Rd in McGraths Hill (Sydney). According to the web site the kit comes with Rancho RS9000 shocks as well(although I'm not sure about the front coilovers). I would have e-mailed them but they don't have an address. Maybe if there are enough people interested we could get a group discount or something(wishful thinking?).

check it out on www.macquarie4x4.com.au

Cheers,
Simon


bambi
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(1/12/03 5:42:37 pm )
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Re: KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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G'day Simon,

I'm not sure where I read this (although I'll try to find out where) but it was a very bad rap for the boys at Macquarrie 4x4 concerning the Prado 4" lift.

This guy had installed one in his Prado, and had no end of trouble with it doing things like destroying CV boots, and the like. the guy also had major suspension problems, and was scathing of the customer support from them. Personally I think that if you need that sort of lift the best way to go is 2" suspension and 2" of body lift.

Cheers,

Troy


bambi
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Re: KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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Ok Simon,

found it

It's on the Overlander forum site, technical folder, page 7. It discusses a 4"lift to a guys Prado by Macquarrie 4x4, and the response when they encountered problems.

I have heard other people have dealt with them and have had no problems at all.

Cheers,

Troy

Simonsurf
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(1/13/03 9:00:31 am )
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Re: KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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Thanks Troy,
I had a look at the Overlander site and read the Prado story. It's a shame he didn't get more responses from others that had it done. I don't want to lift the body too much (30mm at most) as you don't get the same same benefits as a suspension lift. With a suspension lift you get more travel and articulation plus more ground clearance under the chassis. Whereas a body lift won't give you any more clearance under the chassis but is good for when you want to fit larger diameter tyres. I currently have 265/70 16 on and would only ever go to 285/75 16s. A 30 mm body lift would cover this. The main reason I wouldn't go any larger is the low range gearing is fairly marginal now and the larger the dia of your tyres the higher the actual final gearing. I don't think Rockhopper have a gearset for our transfer case yet.
Anyway thanks for the tip off. I'm a bit impulsive!!
Cheers,
Simon


bambi
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(1/13/03 10:13:45 am )
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Re: KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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Hi Simon,

yeah a pity that the guy didn't get a better response on that issue. I have actually done a 2" suspension lift using OME springs and shocks and I'm happy with the outcome. I added a little bit more with moving to 265/75 R16 A/T's which have helped as well. Any higher lift will start to give you CV boot problems.

Be carefull with the 285's as I have heard that they can foul the steering when on full lock, and to be honest I'm not really sure if you would really gain much benefit from the extra width. I suppose it depends what you really want to use your Surf for?

Hope it helped you

Cheers,

Troy


Simonsurf
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(1/13/03 1:37:35 pm )
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Re: KZN 185 4" Suspension lift Kit
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I want the wider tyres for the beach as I only live about 20-25 mins from the beach. I'll keep looking into the suspension I suppose. I did read that one Bloke fixed the C.V boot problem by getting larger boots and that was his only problem with the whole set up.

Simon

Edited by: Just Cruzin at: 6/26/03 6:00 am

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5/28/03 7:04 pm
Reply
Spring - Recommendations Just Cruzin
Beddo
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(10/21/02 6:14 pm )
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Springs - Kings v's Dobson - KZN185 (Troy ?)
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Has anyone heard about Dobson springs and have any good results with these - I want to raise my KZN185 by 50-60mm and be able to cope with metal bullbar & winch, but not be too harsh. Any advice will be good - Hey Troy have you done your susp yet ?

bambi
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(10/22/02 8:21 am )
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Re: Springs - Kings v's Dobson - KZN185 (Troy ?)
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G'day Beddo,

no, but the surf is going down to South Coast 4WD today to have the springs and shocks done. The guy down there was great and did some homework for me at the ARB factory down in Melb when he was there.

So, have decided to go OME. From what I have seen they have a good reputation, time will tell that I suppose. When I get it back I'll put some part numbers on here for us 185's to look at. Going up to sunny QLD for a few weekns next Wednesday.

Cheers,
Troy.

p.s. I didn't know you were a gumnut burner!

bambi
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Re: Springs - Kings v's Dobson - KZN185 (Troy ?)
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G'day Beddo,

just not long back from the nice guys down at South Coast 4WD (Fairy Meadow 02-4227 1900). Anyways, the surf rides heaps better than it did before. They put in all OME suspension pieces and gave it a good wheel alignment after they had finished with it. Will be taking it up to Qld next Tuseday for a few weeks.

Can't complain about the price either. Will let you know when I get a few more miles on the surf.

Part Numbers:

Front Shocks OME N91
Rear Shocks OME N86
Front Springs OME 881
Rear Springs OME 891

Hope these help Beddo.

Cheers,

Troy.

Beddo
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(10/26/02 2:17 pm )
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KZN185 suspension
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Troy, yeh I have been looking at OME, did you get the heavy or medium duty springs ? What height increase did you get ? Price looks good from what I was quoted on others. OME quote was $1350, others were $1800. Is the ride harsh or what compared to the soft / hard setting, Cheers Jeff
PS. Yeh I work for Parks & Wildife and we are burning heaps of gum nuts, and everything else. So I am doing heaps of 4WDing in dust and smoke at present.

bambi
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(10/26/02 3:22 pm )
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Re: KZN185 suspension
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Hi again,

the rear springs are medium duty ones and the front ones are heavy duty. After talking to the guys down there, it was agreed that this particular set-up would be the best for my situation, that is not overloading the rear of the car. This rear set will take 150kgs of load (over the weight of the car)before they even look like going down any.

The car rides great, and has been raised at least 50mm at the front and maybe a touch more at the rear, not to mention generally feeling much better to drive. The part numbers above are the set-up. Price wise, it was around $1400 inculding a wheel alignment.

Cheers,

Troy.

Beddo
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(10/26/02 9:51 pm )
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KZN185
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Troy, sounds good - does it look much higher and does it ride similiar to the hard or soft setting or different all together. Price is good. Also how sagged were your old suspension ? Thanks for the help - I guess you were a Guinea Pig. Troy are you Sydney based ? Cheers Beddo (Jeff)

bambi
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(10/27/02 8:01 am )
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Re: KZN185
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G'day Beddo,

ok, first yes I am Sydney based. Yes the old springs were u/s that's the main reason why I did the replacement. The Surf sits about 3" higher than it did before hand. The front cv's are looking ok as well, not too much of an angle there. My car doesn't have the soft/hard settings. As for the ride, well it is harder but that's what I expected it to be (would have been pissed if it had been the same !!!), but it does ride heaps better than before. The old springs tended to wallow some, now it feels much more positive.

Hope that helps you. Going up to Qld on Tuesday, and will be there until the beginning of Dec, but will let you know when I get back.

Cheers,

Troy.

Beddo
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(10/30/02 2:27 pm )
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Suspension & QLD
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Thanks for info Troy, whats in QLD - is it work or play. What does your 185 have on it - what model and colour. We should get a few photos of our models up on the site.

bambi
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(12/4/02 9:45 am )
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Re: Springs - Kings v's Dobson - KZN185 (Troy ?)
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G'day Beddo,

am now back from sunny Qld with the bus. The Old Man Emu suspension that I had put on before I left did a great job, and has really improved the all round performance of the Surf both on road and off. As I mentioned earlier the new springs lifted the Surf about 3" higher, and now I have new tyres (BFG 265/75 R16) on it.

The whole package works really well when you get it off road. Next step might just be a 2" body lift. We'll see, cause it looks like I might have some problems with airconditioning piping going to the consensor at the front of the vehicle. Apart from that I think it looks straight forward.

I'll have to get some photos on here when I get around to it.

Cheers,

Troy.

bambi
Master (50+ posts)
Posts: 68
(12/4/02 2:24 pm )
211.28.96.40
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Re: Springs - Kings v's Dobson - KZN185 (Troy ?)
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Hey Beddo,

it cost about $1400 all up. This included all 4 springs (heavy duty at front and medium heavy on rear) and the 4 shocks to go with the springs. They also gave the Surf a really good wheel alignment.

I have to take it back to them next Tuesday morning for them to have a check on everything they did, just so as they (& me) are happy with the lot.

Really good people down there, wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anybody.

Cheers,

Troy.

Here to Help

Posts: 678
6/27/03 6:23 am
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Replies
KZN185 - SUSPENSION Just Cruzin 4/24/03 8:21 am
    Suspension Upgrade Just Cruzin 5/25/03 9:58 pm
    Suspension Lift Just Cruzin 5/28/03 7:04 pm
    Spring - Recommendations Just Cruzin 6/27/03 6:23 am



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