Allows magi to conjure objects and try to use them for indirect effects (which would be blocked by AM5).

This is true - but for the base object to be 'natural' I'd base damage on the environmental damage tables on p181.

Thus damages will be less than direct magical damage spells, and the arts needed to create and move large objects will need to be quite impressive.

This compromise (to avoid the AM5 exploits) does leave a possibility of higher level exploits - though the troupe tolerating a player abusing such loopholes is unlikely.

Unclear as when spells are direct effect - and when they can use a targetting roll.

This is true. In the AM5 canon it only refers to environmental effects (e.g. create a pit under someone's feet, place a huge mundane boulder above their head, etc). This ability was a feature of previous AM incarnations - and we survived those games without such abuse becoming a problem.

Indeed, this lack of clarity (when targetting is appropriate) could give us the wriggle room we need, as a troupe, to make the compromise work. Given that very few spells are targetted (most automatically hit) - then we can, as a troupe, be very conservative about allowing targetted spells. Many (if not all) Rego spells could be made to be automatic hit - thus ensuring Parma Magica could resist the effects. (In AM5 there is no such thing as momentum, btw)

Alternatively, we could simply have a rule that making objects move against their elemental nature (e.g. make a rock hover above someone's head) adds a ridiculous modifier to the effect.

Appears to allow a subtle sort of 'spell suppression' for additional magical effects.

It looks like a sneaky spell suppression when you hit someone with a sword which has Blade of Virulent Flame upon it - and only the sword hits.

However, we could think of the Parma as simply 'warding' the effect. So the Virulent Flames simply cannot enter the parma - they are pushed back - springing back across the whole blade when the sword is back away from the Parma.

More problematic is - for instance - when you turn a magical wolf's teeth to iron (because the additional spell effect is not separate from the base object - so it's hard to see how only the spell effect is warded).

I'd suggest fudging this - and simply say that the spell effect is warded - the teeth still bite, but the iron aspect of the teeth cause no extra damage, or discomfort (for fae, etc).

Edited by: Badger101 at: 31/1/06 17:04

Transformation of the crushing tree MuHe 15

Yes - I thought of this on the way to run Nick and Simon's prelude. The conception above also allows the low level muto spell to suppress huge fires (thus rendering ReIg wards fairly pants).

I've had some further thoughts - and will post them on a new thread.

Thanks again for destruction testing these systems - as frustrating as it is for me it is really handy - and helping me shape up these ideas to reflect the aspects I want to maintain and head towards consistency.