Rogue Guide PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS IS A VERY OLD GUIDE. THIS IS BEING KEPT FOR HISTORICAL PURPOSES. FOR MORE CURRENT INFORMATION, PLEASE SEE THE UPDATED ROGUE FAQ 4.0 AND EQ ROGUE GUIDE
Wolvinsbane posted this excellent rogue guide. Thanks and enjoy!
----------------- A few of us have been working on this guide. I'd like to submit it publically so everyone can add/change/etc...
I'd like to add to it a table of pickpocketing success / failure, backstab for how much with what weapon table...etc. Really make the guide worthwhile.
Once it's finished, we should submit it to eq.stratics as they were looking for a good guide for our class. Lets give em one.
First things first. This character is a group character. What I mean by this is that Rogues aren't tanks. They can't solo very well. They don't have spells to hit from afar. They do best in a group. If you're not a group player, stay away from the Rogue class as you will get VERY frustrated with many creatures. I'm not trying to say that the Rogue cannot be solo'd effectivly, it's just very hard. Expect all fights with even creatures to be down to the wire. You'll be resting a LOT unless you have a cleric friend nearby.
Another thing that I've found out is (at least on the Mithaneal Marr server) that there simply are NOT many Rogues out there. People really miss out on what an awesome contribution that one or two can add to a group. They are simply one of, if not THE best group characters in the game.
OK.
==========Character Creation==========
Not much here. Basically your big point is Agility. The higher it is, the more often creatures will miss when fighting you. It's a VERY good thing to have high numbers in, pump it to 100 - 105. Other than that put some in Dex (so you can hit more often) and Str (duh) also.
OK, you've just started your character out and have been dumped in front of your home city. First thing to do is find the Rogue guild. In Qeynos it's hidden so you'll have to look around to find it. Read your guild note that you start out with for a clue. It's usually pretty easy. Talk to your guildmaster and put one point into peircing to get it started. Your long term goal is to save almost all your practices up to level 10 for backstab.
Time to head out and kill some stuff. Not much too it. Head out to the newbie zone in front of your town and start killing snakes, rats and stuff. Keep close to the guards in case you get in trouble. Also, don't worry about dying. You won't start loosing experience until level 5, so for now, all you have to do is retrieve your guild shirt and dagger from your body when you get turned into paste by a resident baddie.
Keep killing stuff until you hit about level 3. It takes time.
It's also a good idea to put a practice into one handed slashing at some point during your leveling. The reason for doing this is that once you max out your peircing for the level, switch to your one handed slashing weapon and hack away. You won't regret it when you get Dual Wield and want to have that Mino Axe work up to it's potential. You don't *have* to do this, but it is HIGHLY suggested that you pay as much attention to it as you do your other skills. Your versatility can make you a better Rogue.
I also highly suggest that you begin taking up a trade skill. My suggestion is Tailoring or Blacksmithing. It will be a valuble asset later in the game as you'll be able to see when you read how much I had to pay for my Banded Armor that is ONLY player made.
**MORE Level 1-5 TIPS** by Zarhne the Dark Elf Rogue on Solusek Ro
The guild hall in Neriak isn't hard to find at all (maybe because we're Dark Elves??). Just head to the 3rd Gate (it's the 3rd zone in Neriak), go around the Cleric's guild, continue down the tunnel util you reach a gate, pass through the gate and head right. The guild is the only building you'll see.
Once you've received your tunic, you can either go out and start killing things in Nektulos forest or engage in a quest. I believe the quest has to do with killing fire beetles and putting their legs and eyes in a box, then returning it for experience, coins, and a faction adjustment. I'm not sure on this because I never did it.
When you start out, you'll probably want to stick with Moss Snakes. You'll probably get some scales and maybe an egg. Needless to say, in these early levels take everything and once your inventory is full, sell it all in the city. Anything else while you're level 1-3, I suggest fighting with another friend or two. You don't necessarily have to group, but just remember that whoever does the majority of the damage gets the experience. Once you hit level 4-5 hopefully, you'll have a few gold pieces saved up so you'll be able to buy a Giant Snake Fang. This is a great weapon. I used mine until level 10. Sometimes it's hard to find people who are auctioning it, but it's we'll worth the searching. I've seen them sell for anywhere between 5gp and 1pp, but you should be able to get one for around 5-7gp. A skill that rogues sometimes neglect is 1H Slashing. Don't forget to practice this! Carry a rusty slashing weapon with you and once your piercing is maxed out, use the slashing weapon. This skill, like piercing, will increase fairly quickly just through fighting. So far, it seems like there are a lot more slashing weapons out there than piercing, so when you come across the magical "10,000pts of damage with one blow" broadsword, you'll want to be able to use it! ****
Basically, it's time to move on. If you're a Qeynosian or Barbarian from Halas, it's time to head to Black Burrow. Black Burrow is a Gnoll Clan that's located close to Qeynos. It serves as the gateway for Barbarians travelling from Halas, their home city, to the Qeynos Hills. It is the only avenue they have. It's a wonderful place for level 5 - 15 ranges. At level 6, it's a good idea not to enter Black Burrow on your own. Instead, linger outside and kill Gnoll Watchers with a group until you level to 7 or 8, then head on into Black Burrow's entrance and prepare for some nasty fights and a lot of deaths.
Black Burrow is made up a few "levels". The upper level is where you'll be. It's great for killing regular Gnolls and Gnoll Pups. Many of the Gnolls up here are armed with weapons that sell for between 1-3 gold. It's about time to start saving up for your first armor set, leather.
**MORE Level 6-10 TIPS** by Zarhne the Dark Elf Rogue on Solusek Ro
Nektulos Forest was a wide range of mobs. Staying close to the entrance of the city will allow you to fight lower level creatures with the safety of being able to run back to the guards if things start to turn ugly. As you attain higher levels, you will gradually head out further away from the city entrance and start fighting by the road. There's a log by the road that most players use to keep their bearings, meet, and rest at. By now, you should be able to take on some harder creatures. Spiderlings and fire beetles are plentiful and the loot you get off them is pretty good (fire beetle eyes sell for 2sp 2cp), but the real prize at this level is the decaying skeleton, especially the ones carrying weapons. I'm always on the look out for these because they aren't terribly hard to fight, but they usually have decent loot. Although, the ones carring weapons are a bit harder, once you kill them you get the weapon. This is good because you can either use the weapon, if you need it, or sell it. In general, bashing weapons will get you in excess of 2gp and slashing will give you more or less 1gp, depending on the weapon. Be careful when looking for decaying skeletons. Regular skeletons and decaying look EXACTLY alike. Always /con your target before attacking! If it's a regular skeleton, run away. They are aggressive and if your close by they will come after you.
Once you hit level 7, run back to the guild and spend one practice point on Pick Pockets and head back out and practice, practice, practice. You probably won't steal anything for quite a while, but you still need to build it up. The skill will increase even though you don't succeed. What I did to raise it was travel to the East Commomlands (a zone right next to Nektulos) and find an Orc Pawn and practice on him. If they start attacking you, don't worry, they're not hard to kill, but they will run away once their health gets below a certain point. Be VERY careful if you decide to chase them! At this level, pretty much every creature in this zone can kill you with ease. I'd suggest not chasing them because they will eventually come back and attack you. Even when you're fighting something, use Pick Pockets. All you have to do is turn off your attack, pick pockets, and then turn your attack back on. This should only take a split second (if you have your hot keys set up). I've gotten a lot of gold, silver, and copper this way while fighting.
Once you hit levels 8-10, you can try some regular skeletons, shadow wolves, and black bears. Remember to always /con before you attack. Often times, even things that /con blue will be able to kill you. If you get down to around 2 bubbles of health it's probably time to run. Once you get below 2 bubbles of health, a creature can "sense" that you are badly wounded and will keep attacking you until you are dead even if they are being attacked by someone else. If it's getting close, head for the bridge because there's usually a guard or two there (you should know your way around Nektulos Forest by now). Watch out for Young Kodiacs. They look very similar to black bears, but are MUCH harder. Also, be careful when fighting skeletons. If you're fighting one and another is in the area, they'll probably gang up on you and what was, initially, an easy kill, will turn out to be a battle that you could easily lose. ****
In my opinion, the hardest levels. You'll have MAJOR difficulty fighting solo. You can't tank really well, and you don't have the CONTINUOUS crushing power of backstab when fighting alone. It's time to group up in order to gain levels, there's simply no other way. You'll see why the Rogue is really meant for people who like to fight in groups. You can REALLY contribute with your backstab skill and quick, steady hitting. If you decide to solo, creatures that con blue and risky are NOT a given kill. You must be careful if you are going to solo a creature. Either be near a zone, or have characters near you that can help you out. You have no second chance magic or surplus hit points, you'll need an avenue of escape. I can't stress this enough, PLAN your solo attacks and pay VERY close attention to your hit points when fighting blue creatures at this level. Some, if not all blue/risky creatures will either bring you down to next to no hit points or simply kill you. Remember, you are not a Warrior in the traditional sense and cannot take that amount of punishment on a regular basis. You may get lucky once, but you WILL die by creatures like this from time to time.
Around now you'll want to start looking into a new weapon to replace your Giant Snake Fang. I moved up to a Fine Steel Spear that I happened to find a kind Dwarven player selling (thanks Kreegor!) and it REALLY made a big difference. Be advised that this class of weapon is expensive, plan for this by saving your money. You're gonna need it.
You're also prolly starting to get tired of that leather armor that you've been wearing for a while. It's time to make the step up to Banded Armor. You'll only be able to buy it from other players. It's expensive also, prices range from 5pp to 30pp depending on what piece of armor you're looking to buy. The first two pieces that I managed to pick up was a pair of Banded Braclets for 10pp. It was then a good long time till I could purchase my second piece, Banded Sleeves. Those cost me 15pp and I don't think I've recovered since, heh heh.
**MORE Level 6-10 TIPS** by Zarhne the Dark Elf Rogue on Solusek Ro
I know it's been said many times, in many places but I have to say it again...Backstab is what defines a Rogue. Sure Sense Traps, Disarm Traps, and Lock Pick are nice, but currently there are is no real need for them (hopefully there will be soon). Poisoning is another great skill, but (to the best of my knowledge) it hasn't been implemented yet. Dual Wield and Dual Attack are good skills, but warriors and rangers also get them. Only Backstab is rogue specific AND has a tangible value in the game (i.e. lots of damage). Even when you can't sneak up on a mob, you can use Backstab as an extra attack. This helps quite a bit if you do try soloing. Soloing, on occasion, is fun, but it really limits the things you can do as a rogue. When I'm in a group, I love scouting ahead and sneaking up on creatures. The first thing I do is try to Pick Pocket them (what can I say, I'm a rogue!). Once I've gotten a little coinage off of them...WHAM...I poke them right in the back! Then I'm running back to my party whose there ready to finish off the poor guy. (Be careful when sneaking up on animals, Sneak seems to work MUCH better on humanoid creatures.) Oh, lest I forget, I do get my backstabs in while the mob is attacking the group. One thing to watch when fighting in a group is the text of the fight. If the creature is attacking you back off a bit and let it attack your tanks. Once it turns away from you, run back up and backstab it again. You want to be the one dealing the punishment, not taking it. ****
Sneak - Personally, I've found that sneak is not really super useful. Most of the time, it doesn't do anything that special. I tested it a bunch in Black Burrow where I sneaked past Gnolls without it and noticed no difference in the percentage of attacking Gnolls when used. Some people swear by it, but to be honest, at this point I've seen no real use for it. Put one point into it and then keep practicing it. It goes up VERY quickly.
Pick Pockets - Well, I have mixed emotions about this skill. At this point in the game, I can't just go around pick pocketing anyone, lest I get beat into paste. So far, what I can say about this skill is that it's erratic. I've stolen between 3 copper and 3 gold from creatures ranging from Gnoll Pups to Gnoll Commanders. I've stolen Gnoll Scalps off of still living Gnolls (highly amusing if you think about it) and Greater Lightstones off of WillowWisps that people were fighting. Now, I don't want to pump your hopes up. Don't go thinking that you're gonna get rich by pickpocketing WillowWisps for Greater Lightstones and then selling them for 2-3pp at a time. It's rare and to tell you the truth, I don't think this skill really is worth it until later levels when you can pick pocket NPCs and not have to worry about getting your ass beat. Put a point into it when it's available and then keep practicing anytime you can, I know it will be useful later in the game.
Dodge - This skill is GREAT. When you have it, you'll dodge some creature's attacks. It's wonderful at higher levels when you're dodging 4 or 5 hits during a fight. It definatly can make or break an even engagement. When it's available to you, put one point into it and watch it raise by itself. You won't be disapointed!
Sense Traps - Yet another skill that I haven't found a use for yet. At level 13, I still haven't found a place where it could come in handy, there are just no traps around. I've heard that people trying to sense traps to no avail with it. I'm not sure it's working correctly.
Hide - Another questionable skill. I've had mixed results with Hide also. Sometimes it works, sometimes it fails miserably. First lets clear something up. Once fighting, Hide will not work until the fight is over. You can't just start a fight, run around a corner and hide. If the monster has you targeted, he'll just run up to you and engage again. Many people complain that there is no way to tell if you have sucessfully hidden. There is a way. You /con the creature before you hide and it says "creature eyes you angrily, ready to attack", now Hide. If you /con it now and it says "the creature eyes you indifferently", Hide was successful and now that creature doesn't see you. Now, I've been in Black Burrow hiding in the snake pit, resting. I conned the Gnoll in front of me and it conned indifferent. It left me alone. About 2 minutes later, a Gnoll that came up behind me started attacking me. Now, i'm not sure if Hide only effects some creatures or if it effects all creatures. Maybe if you are touched while hideing, the creature can see you. Not sure. Zarhne has told me that the /con trick doesn't work. His suggestion is to simply ask a friend if you are hidden. Pain in the butt, but it's the only SURE way. One point into it and then practice it. Raises VERY quickly.
Apply Poison - No info available.
Parry - Another invaluble skill. It's the same as Dodge, for the most part. It will cause creatures to miss you more often. This ability, Dodge and your high Agility will make creatures miss a LOT more then hit. I promise a smile on your face every time you see it work during the fight. Point it and then it will raise on it's own.
Backstab - The Rogue's bread and butter attack. You'll get this at level 10. It's the skill that makes us Rogues worthwhile in a group. At level 13 with a skill level of 54 in backstab and using a Giant Snake Fang, I do about 31 points of damage per backstab. Change weapons to a Fine Steel Spear, and up that number to 41. That on top of the normal hits i'm doing couple to make me a pretty effective killing machine. That's with a group, however. In a group, you'll have a tank that can keep the monster's attention while you continue to backstab away. Solo, it's a different story. When soloing, you'll get one chance to come up behind the creature and backstab it to initiate the fight. After that, you'll be fighting face to face with the creature and thus you won't be able to backstab. During a face to face fight, backstab acts like a second attack. It will work just like hitting the normal attack button, just considerably slower. Still, it's nice to get that extra attack in there. It can also be used as a way to "taunt" creatures away from a friend who is dying. Monsters DON'T like your backstabbing them, it's evidendly annoying. Save as many points as you can. When you hit level 10, run to your guild, pump ALL the points you can into backstab to get it going. It raises very slowly, especially when fighting solo when you'll only get on backstab in per fight. Group fighting will raise it considerably faster.
Safe Fall - A good skill that has had nasty problems reported. It's notoriously difficult to raise this skill. You need to continuously fall off of things to raise it. To sit there and fall, take a lot of damage, rest then go do it again is tedious to say the least. It's worthwhile, however, as you see when you friend takes 130 points of damage after falling off the cliff and you only take 30. Some people use it to lead trains off of cliffs, damaging them greatly yet not taking a lot of damage themselves. They then finish the weakened creatures off after the fall. Don't know if this is really a fair tactic. In my book it is; sounds nice and Roguish to me. Heh heh.
Double Attack - A wonderful Skill that adds a second strike when succesful. It's automatic so you'll be fighting and sometimes during a strike, a second hit will occur. It raises quickly. I'm not sure if it also kicks in while backstabbing, but I can only assume so. This makes it a VERY useful skill. One point when you get it at level 16 and watch it raise quickly.
Riposte - A high level skill. No information available.
Remove Traps - Once a trap is found, you should be able to remove it. No word on this skill yet.
Make Poison - Another high level skill that reportedly works. Not sure about the effectivness of it or what you can make.
Dual Wield - Whoa momma! Good stuff here. You'll have this available at level 15. It allows you to carry and strike with a second weapon. You'll want to keep your primary weapon piercing but your second weapon can be whatever other weapon you'd like. This includes whips, axes, swords and the like. The idea of two Fine Steel Spears doing double attack makes me shudder and drool a lot.
Pick Locks - This is a gray area skill. The reason I say this is because there are simply not many locks that need picking around. It's unfortunate. I can't speak for the higher level rogues, but this skill simply will not be needed before level 17 or so. Even that estimate is a guess. I've heard of a few dungeons that require a lock picker at some doors in their depths and many have said that a Rogue in this situation would have REALLY come in handy. If there are a lot more locked doors in higher level dungeons, then you'll soon find that Rogues are going to be VERY sought after.
==========Conclusions==========
This class is simply awesome. As a group character, we're unmatched, IMHO. You just can't beat a character that does fair to VERY good melee damage quicker then all classes but the monk AND adds a massive backstab into the fray every so often. You'll not have a wonderful time soloing creatures until you hit level 16 as you simply can't dish out enough damage FACE to FACE as the Warrior class. Turn that creature around, and it's a different story though ;)
You'll also find that you have a lot of options for rollplay. This character is suited to play just about any lifestyle he wants to. From thief to simply a mischivous wanderer, the Rogue will play right into it. Rogues are simply shadey characters. I liken them to a modern day Navy SEAL ... it's not the brute force of a headon attack that makes them so dangerous (although they can hold their own with the best in that too), but instead the sneaking in for the kill and hitting from behind that makes them deadly.
An enemy not seen or heard is invinsible. ------- Edited by Kezzek at: 7/25/00 1:20:34 pm
This guide is also posted in the Main Lounge forum where you *can* post your comments and suggestions so that Wolvinsbane, its creator, can make the necessary changes.
Once he makes the changes and has a new version he'll repost it again in a new thread (in the Main Lounge) and the comments process can start all over again. I will then snag it and replace this one with the latest version.
Enjoy!
---------------------------
Remmi, Cazic-Thule
The Safehouse Admin
at: 7/25/00 1:20:34 pm
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